the one issue we need to face is resource costs and energy prices. that is not a question which is being driven by overuse at the moment, it's being driven by other factors. i'm not as optimistic as stephanie is about the long-term potential path, but is there a trade-off between what we should do to protect our elderly population and to provide adequate medical care to the whole poppation and what we should do to reconstruct our infrastructure and address energy and climate issues? no. we are underperforming on both fronts. >> but there's a -- it's not a budget tear trade-off, it's -- budgetary trade-off, as long as we think revenues can only be this high, then there's a fight among those priorities. we have to accept having higher revenues to pay for the things we want. that softens that trade-off. the entitlements are not, are not a drain on real resources, they're a transfer. but there is a question of public sector investment versus what's going on in the private sector. when we're at full capacity, we have that trade-off. but the issue is, um,